I have finished my undergraduate in biology . Till now,  i am not sure what i want to do. I have been thinking about studying medical or dental . Since it is so expensive to study here in america, i have been researching to study abroad like in India or in philipines. Can anybody suggest me if this will be a better step. and also tell me what i have to do after i finish the study back there and come here in US. Please advise me wisely.

so i don't know about the process of studying in india or the philippines. but if you plan to come back to the US, you will have to take USMLE Step I and II and then apply for residencies here before you can practice medicine in the US. You may know that medical graduates from abroad have a huge disadvantage in residency placements. however, if you were to attend medschool in the US, you will not be disadvantaged (regardless of your citizenship).

Very few US medschools accept international students but they do exist and it's possible to get fiancial aid for attendance (loans and also scholarships) as well.

so, the trade off is cheaper tuition and less competitive entrance (not in india, of course, which is very competitive) vs a disadvantage in residency placement. i do not know all of your preferences but if you have a competitive academic and extra-curricular record, you may want to try applying in the US, which may be more competitive and expensive (not if you can secure scholarships) but will give you a strong advantage if you want to specialize and practice in the US.

thankx bibhav9. i am still looking for some more suggestions. thanks

had you decided about pursuing medical science after completion of your +2 back in nepal, probably you would be doing internship at this time and in a year or two you would be here applying colleges/hospitals for residency.  the big advantage of foreign MBBS is that they can complete education in shorter period with comparatively low cost.  however, in usa, the cost is very very high and getting into medical school is really tough and takes a long time ( 6 years after undergrad) to complete.  However, you will get MD unlike in nepal or india, where you get MBBS.  anyways, you can try if you have very good academic records and MCAT score.  it does nt hurt to try.  good luck. 

Just to comment on the time issue.
post high school
in nepal: about 1 year to get admission and start studies; 5 years in medical school. 1 year to prepare for and take Step I and II get visa and go to US; after in US, 1 year for residency interviews and Step II CK.
in US: 4 yrs undergrad, 4 yrs MD (USMLE taken during MD).
is 8 years in both cases and after you pass your USMLE boards MBBS will be equal to MD.

another issue you will have to consider if studying MD in the US is getting loans. few schools provide direct loans to international students but most will not and you'll need a US person co-signing your loans.
MD/PhD is an option if you are into basic science research. time for completion goes up by about 4 years but everything is paid for. again, not available for internationals in all schools but there are some who will fund MD/PhD for non-US citizens as well.

good luck.

sorry meant to say Step II CS (not CK)
btw, why is this thread listed under computer/IT? :)

thankx again bibhv9. I am an american citizen right now. i have been trying here in america as well as abroad too. since i have undergraduate degree from US, it does make it bad for me to seek outside US. One of the biggest situation is the financial problem and secondly it is my low gpa in my undergraduate. Looks like you have pretty good idea about this field. i am just confused with the whole scenario of  7 more years of  study. which looks really bumpy and rough to me. Thanx again. keep posting if you have some more suggestions.

If you want to be a medical doctor and with literally no-financial expenses of your own, here is what you can do:

Try for MD/PhD programs. Most of the medical colleges have this program. Its a dual degree program, where, first two years you go to medical college ( M1 and M2), than you will spend 3-4 yrs in graduate school and get a PhD, and go back to medical school( M3 and M4). Technically the program is about 7 yrs long and at the end, you will get dual degee, MD and a PhD.

The biggest catch is that all the financial expences are covered from the school, plus you will get a descent stipend. It basically means that you are paid to study by the school. However, in any medical colleges that have a capacity to take about 200 medical students a year, they will only take 2 to 3 MD/PhD student. So, the bottom line is you gotta be one of a kind and really good academically to be able to get into such programs. After the completion of the program, if you prefer to be a clinician and practise independently, you have to do residency of about 4 yrs. However, you can just be a physician with MD degree, but have to practise medical degree always under someone's supervision. You can do research in clinical or basic science field with your MD/PhD degree.

Shoot me an email if you need more information on this regard.

Good luck

i wanted to email you but lets keep adding notes here in case others might find it useful.

let me suggest what i think are the pros and cons of all the different ways you can complete medical schools with minimal loans:

1. MD/PhD: as has been mentioned, much longer course, EXTREMELY competitive and will need a very strong background and commitment to basic science. in medical school, you will be taking few extra classes and during the first summer you HAVE to rotate in basic science labs (vs. just med students who can do pretty much any kind of internship they want). it takes much longer and some people think the income forgone because of the time it takes is not worth the financial assistance. At the end, you will have become so specialized in one particular aspect of medical research that few will just be medical practitioners and will work in research and/or work toward faculty positions. payrates are much lower for these positions (starting at ~60,000) compared to full-time clinicians (varies by specialty, internal med ~100K and others upwards of that and it goes up the more you specialize). People do not recommend that you do an MD/PhD just for sake of $$ since it doesn't seem to help you all that much in the long run and it is a very rigorous program. Note that you will still have to do residency (minimum 3 yrs) before you can practice with an MD/PhD.

2. Getting it at another country. we talked about this already. less competitive but huge disadvantage in residency placements. Even for US citizens.and this is NOT faster.

3. State school. this will not be applicable to non-US citizens. state schools are lot cheaper and have higher acceptance rates than private schools. Some state schools are clearly the exceptions like the UC schools, Washington etc. Private schools have more resources for research but if you are more interested in private practice then it doesn't matter where you go.

4. Merit/Need-based scholarships. Much easier for US citizens but some schools (usually the most selective ones) do not discriminate by citizenship for financial aid. Policies change frequently so your best bet is emailing the schools and asking them (of finding out online): a. are their policies different for international students. b. what is their base loan amount? This is the amount that you have to take out in loans. If your financial need (total cost of attendance - your financial resources) is greater than the base loan, the rest can be scholarship... again in few schools only.And some schools, like Vanderbilt (and UPenn for US citizens), will give merit scholarships as well. All financial aid is very competitive for medschools so if you believe you application is not very strong then you may want to try a few things: take extra science classes at local institutions to boost your GPA (your science GPA is measured separately and carries a lot more weight than your overall GPA), do research at a lab in a medical school for a year or two, form connections there, enroll in relevant programs that will help in medicine and also in forming contacts like MPH.

All said and done, I say you closely examine whether all of this is worth it and how it applies to your current situation and your career goal. an average MD student probably graduates with about 100K in loans (higher in private schools). You have about 15 years to pay it back so many think it's not too bad, especially if you have the passion to become a doctor. Others may opt for degrees like OD (doctor of optometry), DDS/DDM (dental), Nursing or PA where you need not do a residency and can work in healthcare right after finishing school. Another option may be getting a DO (Osteopathy), which, in the US, is the same as an MD. Schools are less selective but you learn and practice medicine. I do not know about costs/scholarships but worth researching.

one last comment on what you said abotu 7 more years of study. residency is a paid training program and does not need to be viewed as "school". Pay is not very high (depends on specialty, low in internal medicine, pediatrics, family medicine and much higher in radiology) during residency but it's a job. just so you take this into account and note that you are not looking at 7 years of sitting through lectures.

good luck and add any further questions you may have.

thankx all of you, especially bibhav9, for detail information for me and all other interested medical students. I think it did help me to answer some of my questions that were going through my mind.  I am hoping if you could explain me some more about residency too. thankx again.

bivhav9, I was also reading your threads closely...it's really very informative...thank you so much...I also have some interest in medicine as Peacetime (the originator of this thread). Now I am preparing for MCAT...so my question is: do little low MCAT score and good science GPA help in getting selected or the MCAT score  has to be strong...what is your advise on improving MCAT score...is there any colleges that you know of which don't take MCAT score so heavily...

It's obviously difficult to accurately predict the impact of MCAT scores. Also depends on what you mean by "little low scores". Look at the average MCAT scores of the schools you are interested in. If you find that your score is lower than that, don't fret since 50% of the people who attend that school scored lower than the average.
improving MCAT scores, i think, is just a matter of doing a lot practice tests. After you run through all the topics that are covered, don't worry too much about memorizing every detail and just do as many practice tests as you can. Prep courses like Kaplan etc will make you think it's all about memorizing the info but it's not true (only 1 in 7 questions on MCAT rely 100% on memorization and even those questions don't test petty details). And although the real practice tests (ones you buy from the official site) are expensive, you should go for those (again, kaplan tests make you think you should go home and learn the facts some more aka take their course so go for the real tests).

if you still end up with a lower than expected score, try to compensate with other things like research.
Most schools create a score for you: your mcat score + Science GPA (multiplied by an index that depends on which school you attended: some schools will have a higher index if the admissions office thinks the same grade at that school means more than that grade at another school). They will create a cut-off and only those applicants whose scores are above the cut-off are considered. there are exceptions (if you have contacts at the school, did research there etc). After you make the cut-off, you'll get more breathing room to convince the admissions committee that you are a good candidate based on your personal statement, recommendations, activities etc. The fact remains that mcats matter a lot. not so much as lsats would matter for law schools but higher than GREs for most gradschools.

and you probably know about this site. several people there have lot more experience than i do. For pre-med stuff go to medical > Pre-medical students (under Forums) and post questions. http://www.studentdoctor.net/   Don't let this site overwhelm you though; a lot of very anxious people there who are very good at freaking everyone else out.

Now comes talk about what happens if you don't get into Medical School. I know individuals with high MCAT scores and GPA not get in because of their interview. I know some that got in because of their interview despite of their GPA and MCAT Scores...and I know some that didn't get accepted.

What does that mean? I don't think it is the end of the world. There is always a next year. Personally, if you stay committed to Medicine in the years you are off, the Medical schools take that into consideration. There's no wrong in trying to do a Master's or PhD program (Something close to Biology or Medicine) and then trying another year. That would, in many cases, be better than just doing odd jobs during the years off. There are also many post-Baccalaureate programs around the United States that you can enroll in. These train you for basic sciences and you can boost your GPA this way (And admissions boards of the colleges from the university you're doing Post-Bac through look at the extra effort as well).

I am in the process of applying to Medical School as well. If I don't get in (which has the higher odds than me actually getting in), I will be applying for a Masters program at my school.

It's a long way to Medical school and medical merit, but it seems to be worth it. We just gotta keep on truckin'!

i was hoping somebody would explain about residency in more detail . especially if you have degree from abroad. thank you.

http://www.internationaldoc.com/

thankx again to bibhav9 (mr medical guru).