Abortion and contraceptive education.......right or wrong? My view is every woman should have to right to choose with what she wants to do with her body! What do u think???

You are absolutely right matrixrose...

Ermm, no I have never been in a relationship, nor do I intend to. But what does that have to do with anything?

If anybody here can give me a good reason why killing a fetus is a good option, even though there are places where you can dump your baby if you don't want it--however, the parameters I highlighted in my previous post, like the mother's health, which I consider to be exceptions, still stand, and abortion for those reasons are okay in my book--then PLEASE tell me why abortion is a good idea.
You guys keep saying that life might be hard for the parents, and also the baby. I provided a simple option. Adoption agency. Otherwise, it's basically punishing the fetus for the parents' crummy decisions.

Now I talked about some of the exceptions when abortion can be acceptable, at least to me. Tell me WHY abortion should be okay even when reasons are dubious? This doesn't make sense to me.

How about some responsibility, people?

Look, I am an atheist, and the reasons why I believe abortion is a heinous act have nothing to do with religion. I have my own set of moral values and I try to adhere to it.

again here we go again.... I don't think the embryo and fetus up to that point are humans. They are not capable of life outside the womb, and thus are more a part of the woman's body than a unique entity. So science once again can clear this issue up, and determine when the baby can live out of the womb. Abortion is OK before a certain time, because the fetus isn't technically alive before then.

2: Murder isn't OK anytime! Slaughtering innocent children is murder!

*repeat*

Life is just freakin'g overrated anyway. I, personally, define life as viable biological function. No more, no less, no different. I'm not even going to get into whatever 'soul' might be. That'd be impossible to discuss even if there were some basis in perception to start from - it's just plain intangible. And please don't preach to me; I guarantee it'll be a waste of your time. I'm not agnostic merely for the hell of it, you know.

That's your definition of life, not mine. First of, my definition of life starts right after the formation of the zygote. Your definition of what's life and what's not is extreme even for someone who is pro-choice. Remember that fetuses, at some point, have their own heart, their own eyes, their own bodily functions, etc. You seem to be okay with partial abortions also. Remember, they're done in second and third trimesters of pregnancy. This to me seems to be an act of murder. I see that you think of a fetus as a parasite. A fetus, while not a fully fledged human being, is still as LIVING as you and I.

Fetuses are even more innocent than children. At least children, while still vulnerable, can run away if someone comes at you with an axe. Fetuses have nowhere to run!

Now look, if experiments are performed outside of the uterus(for example zapping an ovary with a sperm cell for experiments), to me that's okay. My opinion is that as long as the embryo is in the uterus, it's human.

YOu're telling me that this doesn't have any similarity to a human being, are you?

Well i think i said more than enough and neither want to repeat or change your mind cause its not my intention.You have shown me you lack the ability to understand the whole situation. If you cant accept dont.....but let others live their life as they want. We dont have the right to interfear in anyones personal decision and neither bitch at them.

THE END.

"You have shown me you lack the ability to understand the whole situation"

All right fine.
I beat you in the debate fair and square. That's why you're resorting to ad hominem attacks.

THE END

P.S. Life is more than a biological function. Mind for example is an abstract concept.

LOL...if you feel that good for you.......but do read all those replies especially from the ladies. Take care of your own life......let the others live the way they want.

oki.. firstly nepali con ji it aint so easy as you say it is... a person who doesnt want a baby carrying it for 9 months and then going to an agency and dropping it off there

Secondly the thing u posted in an embryo that is already in the last stages.. and if abortion is done in the first stages... i.e. as soon as pregnency is detected then it shouldnt be a problem.. should it?

After the formation of zygote.. which is a mere tissue.. for some time the embryo is only a bunch of tissue.. and i dun think removing it is considered murder.. well my thoughts hai feri!!

(P.S: sorry for posting all this after THE END.. hehe:D)

Oh don't worry, I'm pro-life, but I let others decide what they want to do with their lives. So I guess that makes me pro-choice.
Hell, I'm okay with gay marriages too. It's people's choice.

Rythm go ahead..no worries : )...damn i could not stop too.

What makes a week old fetus human? Is it the presence of human DNA? Would a skin graft grown from human DNA be human? Would a kidney? Perhaps the term human is not descriptive enough, would the term "a person" more clearly convey my meaning? Is a week old fetus a person? Murder only involves killing a person, does it not? Turning off life support for a human body which is in a permanent vegetative state is not murder is it? Clearly more than the presence of human body parts is needed for an organism to be a person. You can argue that a brain dead body will never again be a person, while a fetus can potentially become a person. Would you consider a baby born anacephalic, (without a brain), a person? I would argue that a fetus is not and never has been a person, so therefore has no right to develop against the wishes of the mother who IS a person and DOES have rights.

As for the docto's testimony, would it surprise you to learn that doctor's too can base their opinions on religious or philosophical, (as opposed to scientific), beliefs? Would it surprise you to learn that these doctors could have been selected for the testimony they would give? Or that it would have been very easy to find just as many doctors who would NOT consider a fetus human, (in the sense of being a person with rights, not as opposed to being a dog or earthworm), and would have strongly supported abortion rights? There are, obviously, no scientific grounds to make the claim that at the moment of fertilization the egg becomes a "person."

Perhaps the pro-lifers debating here should hold off on patting yourselves on the back
for having won the debate for a little while longer... The claim is that no challenge to
evidence presented for the pro-lifers has been made. I would say no evidence to support the position that a fetus has rights has been presented. Sure, you have quotes from doctors saying the fetus is alive, but that does not make it a person with rights. I was hoping to keep this short, but what the heck I'll continue......

* "Father of Modern Genetics" Dr. Jerome Lejeune told the lawmakers: "To accept the fact that after fertilization has taken place a new human has come into being is no longer a matter of taste or opinion ... it is plain experimental evidence."

What experimental evidence? A new human as opposed to a fish?
* Dr. Hymie Gordon, Chairman, Department of Genetics at the Mayo Clinic, added: "By all the criteria of modern molecular biology, life is present from the moment of conception."

Life is present, but a person?
* Dr. McCarthy de Mere, medical doctor and law professor, University of Tennessee,
testified: "The exact moment of the beginning of personhood and of the human body is at the moment of conception."


pHEWWWW done now.

are we going to discuss abt gay marriages now?

..;)

LOl..rythm i was going to say the same....lets do....hehe.

sure rose sis.. y dun u start with it and i'll continue..:)

Sure sure sisy,,,what about

1)Cigarettes vs. Marijuana
2)Murder vs. Self-defense
3)Being gay vs. Being a pedophile

;))))))

hehe... I have this philospphy class and our prof. talks abt all this all the time.. i wish he could see this thread.. he would instantly become a sajha member!!! hehehehe

Oh yea would be cool....by the way how old is he ? LOL

He is abt 40 and happily married sis....:) but i have other young students in ma class!!;) what do u say?

I think scott peterson was charged with double murder, one for killing his wife and other for his unborn son.

Alright, what makes a fetus human:

1. Heartbeat in a fetus can be detected two weeks after abortion. In other words, most women don't even know they're pregnant by this time, because they have missed their period only once. Also, most abortions are performed after approximately 60 days(that is eight weeks) after conception.

2. Brain waves can be detected in a fetus after approximately 6 weeks after conception. Scientists have shown that fetuses can even dream.

3. Six weeks after conception, movements of fetuses can be detected. In fact responses to touch, sound and pain have also been well documented, and these can be felt after approximately 8th week of pregnancy.

4. The record of a fetus's phenotype is already stored in its DNA. In other words, a fetus already has a destiny.

Of course slicing and dicing an embryo will produce nothing more than what appears to be tissues. Well, what do you expect after such procedure, a live baby? That doesn't make sense, does it?

Now let's talk about rights of fetuses in America:

1. Laci's bill( named after Laci Peterson) makes killing a baby a separate crime. In other words killing the baby will have other criminal implications. This is in America, folks.
2. Partial birth abortion has been made illegal in the United States for a reason. By then a fetus has all vital signs that point to the fact that it is alive. So, try this abortion and you'll be rotting in the cooler for eternity.
3. Bush had planned to introduce a bill to extend health-care coverage to fetuses also. I'm not sure if this bill has passed yet or not.

When the issue of killing fetuses goes to court, the crux of the matter is that the matter of charging somebody rests heavily upon the judge. Now, if the judge is a liberal, he will be pro-choice, and if he's a conservative he'll be pro-life. Judges can declare a law to be unconstitutional if they so desire.