What I do not understand in this debate is that elite from all groups including
Newars of Kathmandu and Thakalis and others, who were close to Rana and Shah Pariwar
helped to sustain the system for 250 years. Newars of Kathmandu have benefited much
more from the system than the Brahmins of Dailekg, for example.  Why only the
Brahmins, majority of whom were as oppressed in this system are being blamed and
prosecuted for no faults of theirs?  Present age is the age of knowledge. Brahmins
were forced to learn for their livelihood. If you remember Brahmin families put book
and pencil on six day of birth of a baby near hiss/her head and are happy if she/he
touches it because it is a sign of learning. From 5 years onward a Brahmin boy is
forced to learn, school or no school. Why is it bad?  When I was a kid I used to
watch from the widow that across our house a seven/eight year boy's Tupi  was tied
by a rope to a peg on the ceiling so that when he napped it will wake him up. He has
a PhD degree now.  If in this modern age if he has advantage over the others,  how
is that exploitation. If they study it is not their fault. The cast system in the
sub-content was devised thousands of years ago. Why to blame the  current generation
of Brahmins, who are contributing to changing the system at this juncture?  It is
true that we need to democratize our power sharing system, open up widely avenues of
study and knowledge and provide support to other groups to lean and enable them to
share power. 

Whole this debate about indigenous and non-indigenous people has been relevant to US
and Australia, where the original residents were annihilated completely in recent
history. They are like in the ZOO now. They have imposed this on UN system. Who came
first to South Asia? or Nepal? Much is made out of abolition of Kipat land system in
the eastern Nepal. It was a capitalist move to free land for individual ownership
and exploitation. Not a feudal measure, as is made out to be by Kaplan. What about
Zamidari system introduced by the British in the sub-continent? Abolition of Kipat
system in Nepal was the completion of the process of individualizing land ownership
in Nepal. Was all land given to Brahmin/ Chetri or divided among Kipat members, who
were Limbus too, I presume. Probably afterwards Brahmin/Chretris bought the land.
The did not get it free as under feudal system of land grants.  I need to study this
in detail and bust the false logic introduced by the West with their policies of
divide and rule. At this juncture I have only some idea not much sound knowledge on
this.  We in South Asia do not have history of annihilation of races as in US or
Australia. What the winning races seem to have done is to integrate all people into
a hierarchy, where they put themselves at the top. Once I asked one of the Janajati
leaders why you raised this issues of indigenous and not-indigenous, he said that
because UN does not recognize Janajati. Even if you look through the Marxist
literature, Marx himself predicted that capitalism will advance incessantly to break
all barriers to free competition between individuals, so that it can exploit their
labor power. Now it's attack is on the nation-states. Further it will break the
group barriers atomizing the individuals as laborers. Janajatis talk about
imperialism of Nepali language but not about the English language, Hindu Festival oh
Dashai but not introduction of Christmas in our public places. There is no doubt
that we need by langue primary education and trilingual school education. But there
is no need  revile the whole process of creation of a Nepali lingua-franca in Nepal.
Those who talk about this send their children to English school.  The laboring class
who has to search for their livelihood  in Nepal, India or overseas can not afford
such luxury. What a fallacy?

I  fail to understand  why have the so called leftists picked up this false logic of
dividing the people in various caste and groups rather than rather than class and
uniting them for a meaningful power sharing and progressive transformation of Nepal.
It seems to be a pure political game, no different from the games of other political
parties or the King , divide and rule? Now they have become victims of their own
doing in Madhesh and given India a free field in Nepal.  

Actual transformation of society can not be achieved by force. It has been proved by
the world history so far, socialist or no socialist violence. The disintegration of
Soviet Union and other eastern European countries  and China's current path even
after the violence of cultural revolution are glaring examples of this failure. On
the other hand some Scandevian countries and India's attempts at social
transformation have been peaceful. It is messy and full of loopholes but it seems
the only way. 

This might sound regressive but I do not consider myself regressive. This needed to
be brought out and I have done it. I am for a just transformation of Nepal's State
structure and social transformation of the society. But I am not ready for breaking
Nepal because it was created by war. All modern states have been created by war. The
issue is how we transform it to suit the equality and equity oriented age do 21st
century. 

That is all for now.  
Meena Acharya
Baneswor 

Girija=Prachanda=Bhattarai=Makune, etc

= Height of USELESSNESS...if these are not BAHUNS THEN WHO THE GOD DAMN ARE>>>>

= see this pic...

 

DAMN BAHUN RAJ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Guys grow up please...

This is the last thing we need while our entire nation is burning.

 

One more time

STOP THIS BULLSHIT

DIVIDED WE FALL.

Learn from the animals:

http://www.sajha.com/sajha/html/openThread.cfm?forum=2&threadid=51875

Wat the heck u think man.....wholly crab!
   First u need to understand wats goin on then make comments...its true that brahmins are almost on the top level of nepal no matter if we talk abut the politics or the srvices.....did u ever try to wonder why?they haven't reached in that position not because of ur father or grandfather....they worked for it.who ever works hard can get it.
 Also,lets talk abut other cast.We can see most of the gurungs, magar,rai limbhu have entered in the military services in India,Singapore,HK,UK and helped to keep the name of ur country....in those area there is not even a single bahun.....compare the income of those military and the bahuns who works in nepal for a mere monthly sum of Rs 6,000.Go and notice the difference between how a boy from a bahun family strives hard to enter in the service and see how a son of a militant enjoys his days,boozing,drinking,with gals and even don't care abut the future.The pressure to do gud in the study is far more greater in bahun family than in other those castes(I don't mean its only in bahun but i m taking abut relative things)...
   There are lots of examples and facts if u dare will find in the society.....So Never,Ever try to raise these kinds of issues.Man, try to judge sth being a neutral otherwise if u are pre occupied by sth ,it will just be a way to lead for futile discussions: u r kiiling ur own time by thinking those things which doesn't make any sense and i m sure you don't want that.Alrite,be positive.......Don't give a space in ur creative mind for those trivial matters.

Well ... I'm glad this post has ruffled quite a few feathers.

People in this blog like you and me understand its futile and not good to drag caste factor in.

But people in the gound dont understand this. And you and me arguing wont stop it.

I am not jealous of Bahuns nor do I have problem them dominating every sphere of life. What I have problem with is the coterie, nepotism culture that has been created and cultural genocide of rest communities that is all designed to unfairly maintain Bahunist superior status forever. 98% of jobs in govt, private sector, politics, education everything is dominated by minority bahuns. Sure they worked for it and deserve to be at the top. But creating unfair hurdles to bar others from progressing is unfair. Nepal is a mosaic of culture and languages, but look at our lok sewa, foreign affairs exams, its so damn sanskritised that its only designed to progress bahuns, majority Nepalese understand only simple Nepali - how will they stand a chance. Take a leaf from India - hindi can be equally sanskritised, but keeping the entire population in mind, although its official lang, its simple to understand, I can understand Hindi news easier than Nepali.

The point is - a minority community cannot decide the fate of majority comprising of many different castes, backgrounds. They have been doing it for years but not anymore. I hate this race war in Nepal but educated people like us discussing the virtues and vices will not change ground situation. Jatiya war is brewing - threatening disintegration of Nepal - Madhesi, Janjati, Dalit ... list goes on. You and me serving virtous sermons here wont change unless these few elites at the top let go and give everybody a role to play and decide their own future. I am a Janjati - and accuse me if you want but I didnt start this racist war or finger pointing - bahunists did - by starting a culture of exclusiveness, eliteness, cultural genocide, corruption and nepotism. Unless the power structure at the top dont change, this wont stop. Keep your head down and think hard for a moment before you accuse me.

Lastly, I strongly believe not all bahuns are bahunists, and bahuns have suffered equally in this war. I share that empathy with them. But surely a handful of Bahunists have been huddling up in baluwatar for past 18 months negotiating how to share power amongst themselves - while the entire country burns in ethnic war that will one day become bigger than Maoists war, if the CA fails to address this issue.

And the biggest proof of existence of Bahunist is - none of the political parties, leaders have a solid strategy, roadmap to solve this mess. Maoists want fully proportional representation not really to solve this mess but more to get power for themselves - I'm sure we all understand this. Else they wouldnt abandon this issue for the comforts of govt when they first joined interim govt.

And remember - this whole 10 yr Maoist war started not coz of monarchy, thats superficial. It started and was successful becoz marginalized were promised a stake. Thats where Maoist drew their power from.

Unless we dont change the structure at the top - my dear educated friends, this country will cease to exist soon. And blaming me wont change anything. If I were a bahun - I'd still say the same. If you still deny it - then you're living in denial.

 

And for those who say - stop this bullshit ..

Well ... I cant stop it. Its happening out there, you and me typing infront our dell laptops sipping starbucks mocha sure wont feel a thing and we can afford the luxury of indulging in ideal, virtous conversations, but reality is reality. Nobody can change it except people in power who has the influence but lack the will (most of whom happens to be bahuns). And they not doing a damn. Perhaps educated peopl like us discussing it openly may one day change things.

But accusing those who bring out this contentious topic of being racist and denying it will surely make things worse. Again, I'm not asking for retribution, but I wont be surprised if some of you come back with stinging criticism, which will be proof enuf how incestous lot our self proclaimed educated intellectuals really are.

So before you accuse me or try to deny reality, perhaps you need to look at things from a different perspective. Because it not just me, but majority in Nepal who feel the same way.

Jai Nepal!!

NP well said!!  In this age where all are trying to be brown-noising diplomats and politically correct in every word, you have brought about your concern which has some valid reasonings.  However in this case, I will refrain from posting any thread on hate as I'd preferably attack individuals rather than a whole group (however, commies are not spared of this wrath). Hahahaha Yes, there are bahuns/matwalis/madhises who are complete azzholes but lets not classify them all as being the same. That’s my take on the issue bro.

Lets now make this thread to rest as this constant caste bickering surely has done no one any good as yet.

Point taken Samsar - I am the last one to lump all bahuns together, infact I have more bahun-chettri frens. But its just the elite few who are creating such problems, we need to get rid of them - be it Bahunists, royals, all the regressive elements basically.

Well...

NorthPoint

 

You again fail to understand my feelings...so you are blaming me as bahunist...I understand what you are trying to message through that post…

 

Actually, I trying to say that kunai pani manche afno life lai lift garnee dukhha garcha ra u deserve garcha bhanneee that is his quality and not a fault.

 

Sabai jat jati ma manish kharab(Bad) hunchan….auta ko dosh le community lai nai dosh dinu…auta educated manche ko nature hainna….

 

Hami sachai afno community ko bare ma aware chau bhannee…kina hami hamro community lai lift garnee kam gardainau….garuna…jasleee hamro community lift hos…

Agreed nnepal - sorry if i came across as someone blaming you or all bahuns as one. I didnt mean to. Believe me. Its educated people like you and me who can reason quickly but not so easy for general people out there.

For Nepal to come together and progress, we need to restructure a lot of things, getting rid of elite feudalistic regressive forces to start with. Shahs/royals who believed this country is their personal property are on their way out. Similarly we must get rid of extrimist and separatist elements. Same way there are feudal Bahunists we need to get rid of. And other regressive elements - be they janjati, madhesi, maoist, pahadi anyone. Once we have this equal, inclusive platform where everyone has a stake, then only can we look forward to a better future. Lets hope all this happens with the tide of time.

I do not mean to disturb the hornet's nest, but who exactly are 'जनजाति' ? Are they same as 'aboroginals' or 'natives' ? If so, on what basis were they classified on that ?

Seriously, I lack knowledge on that.

Namaste! Its amazing to read everybody's whip-lashing comments. Although the Nepali Hindu calender dates this year as 2064, please be reminded that the country as a whole is deemed to be 50 years behind America. The so-called development has only taken place in the minds of the educated minority, who co-incidently prefer to live or work or study overseas. The majority back home are those mostly average and below. Since most of the population falls into this category, would it be easy to divide and rule. Like they say, "The one-eyed Jack is king in the land of the blind!" All of you on this thread keep pointing out the pros and cons, back and forth. Right or wrong, I don't care. What I want to know is who amongst you is capable of putting his foot down, standing up in front of this people, voicing this very opinions, standing for elections, bringing down the bullies, fighting for the people's rights etc etc etc. If there is such a CHOSEN ONE on this thread, stand up, speak up and I WILL GIVE YOU MY SUPPORT TILL THE END! Everybody knows what's happening back home. But nobody has the guts to put the "bullet in the head." Its easy to talk but not so easy to walk your talk. Tell me how many of you plan to go back home permanently, in the near future? If educated people like you cannot understand each other, can you blame the uneducated people back home? You say "we must do this...we must do that..." Who is that "we"? Are you referring to the educated people on Sajha? Do you really think the Sajha members are prepared to sacrifice their current lifestyle, to go back home and fight for their people's rights? Is any one of you a potential candidate for politics? Educated people like you can sit down and talk till the cows come home, but nothing will change for the better. If you want to do something, start by going back home. Go back to your grass roots. Pull out the damned weeds! Throw out the 'Rubbish!' Clean up Nepal, one section at a time. Don't sit in your comfort zone, and chat over a cuppa Starbucks and continue to serve the American nation. If you love your Nepal...than SAVE HER! And HER PEOPLE!! Sent without prejudice.

ब्राह्मण को बिषयमा निकै भाड् भाईदो लेख पढ्न पाईदै छ।
हो, जब सन्क्रित भाषा को उदय सँगइ नयाँ बर्गको उदय भयो। यो नयाँ बर्ग लाई "विद्वानअ" बर्ग को नामले चिनिन्छ।
हरेक धर्म मा ई बर्गले समाजलाई सगालेर एउटा सन्स्कार र आदर्श समाजको रुप दिएका थिए र हुन्छन।
साथै मानब प्राणी सबै भन्दा उत्कृष्ट प्राणी जाती हो भने जहिले पनि आफ्नो बर्गको हित र् आफ्नो पारिवारिक र जातिय हित सबै भन्दा माथि राखी काम गरेक हुन्छ।
आजभोलि ब्यक्तिगत हित र शक्ती को चाहना ले ठुलो रोल खेलेको छ। 
अरु धर्मको र यस्का हर्ताकर्ता हरुले , धर्मको नाममा केके गरेक छैनन। Understand and compare it.
हाम्रा धर्मका आधार यिनै पन्डित हरु भए, यिनी हरुले सन्स्क्रित्मा जे लेखे पनि धर्मकै अन्ङ्स मानिन् थालियो।
अनी इनी हरुले बौद्धिक शोषन गरे, तेही बौद्धिक शोषन को रुप हो ब्रम्हिन हरु अरु भन्दा टा ठा बा ठा भएका।
एक पिडी ले गरेको गल्ती लाई अहिलेको पिडी सँग रिश फेर्न खोज्नु कती उचित होला?
अर्को कुरा , तिनी हरु तेसै टा ठा बा ठा भएका छैनन।
उनिहरुले अनुशासित जिबन सँगले र तेस्को मनन गरे।
अझै पनि त्यो जिन ले काम गरिरहेको हुँदा अर्को दसक सम्म ब्रम्हन वा

तिन्का खत्री खत्रिय शान्ताती अरु बर्ग भन्दा औसत मा उपल्लो बर्गमै निलिन्छन।
यो प्रकृतिको नियम हो र अकाट्य छ।
जती भा ड् भाईलो गर , केही हुने वाला छैन।
यि सबै लेख हरु नाग्लो ठटाएर हात्ती तर्साउने काम जस्तो मात्रा हो।
दिमाग बाट नाकारात्मक कुरा थुपारेर नराख, आर्को दशक पर्ख् यि ब्रम्हिन हरु पनि खसी ( छत्रिय ) जस्ताइ हुने छन। जिन को रुप ब दलिन समय लाग्छ।

NayaSadak, from the start of this thread English has been the written language. Its obvious that you know something that I don't. I would like to be enlightened and would appreciate it if you could kindly translate your posting in English. Otherwise, I would be left hanging by the thread of your mother tongue.

 

Bahuns have many faults, one of them is  they are too much "Singane" and their behavior is also very Singane..

Contours

And your fault is leaving Skidmarks everywhere you go. ha ha ha

 

THIS CONVERSATION IS NOT HELPING ANYONE.

and yours is counting them...

Yep. Skid mark one. Seems a lil old,dry & odorless....man thats gonna scar yo lame ass.